Spencer The Liar

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Spencer The Liar

AFFR
Spencer claimed to have no knowledge of the Pacific Northwest.  He didn't want to admit that all locals are about to be dissolved.  This link is a McCarron letter laying out his national plan.  The Dockbuilders and Millrights are fucked they are not even going to be part of our Council anymore.  Read this and Puke.
http://www.carpenterspnwrc.org/wp/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/G.P.s-notice-with-Interim-Officers.pdf
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Re: Spencer The Liar

listman
Where are the Norhtwest carpenters. Start here reach out we'll help.
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Re: Spencer The Liar

bill lebo
In reply to this post by AFFR
I wouldn't believe a thing any UBC rep says at this point. We've seen this before. They want to keep us as calm and quiet as possible while they do exactly what they said they weren't going to do. They merge and dissolve locals throwing them into chaos and by the time the members get enough momentum to do anything its too late.
It really doesn't matter, we can't do a thing about it at this point.
Besides, bottom line is, we did this to ourselves. They didn't elect Forde,Thomassen,or Greeney, we did. I'm as guilty as anyone, in fact I'm ashamed to say I supported them in the 1st election. I didn't think there was much more of a choice.
We always seem to put people in office who are the power brokers and they always seem to be the ones who are the most corrupt. We never choose the guys that has been out in the field breaking his back in the trenches next to us, the ones who know what are problems are, and what we go through. The candidates who run because they really want to make this a better union and not because they want to stuff their pockets with ill gotten money. Looking back there were choices that would have made a big difference, candidates that very few of us took seriously. Men that were considered dissidents and reformers. These guys had the balls to stand up to the power brokers and spoke up when they saw something wrong.
These candidates were the likes of Mike Biello and Gene Clark.
But no, we went with Forde who turns out to be a thief and drug addict.
I can guarantee one thing, if we had elected Mike Biello or Gene we wouldn't be in the mess we're in now, we wouldn't be under trusteeship, we would have actually had elected officials that cared about the members. What a concept.
Anyway, we are under trusteeship so we're going to have to deal with whatever the UBC throws at us.
However, when we do get the chance to elect new council officers, and we will, I hope that no mob creeps or common scumbag criminals will get past Dennis Walsh's scrutiny.
 This time around we can't afford to screw up, this time I hope we are all smart enough to realize that it's time to elect guys like Mike Biello and Gene and keep the likes of Forde out.  
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Re: Spencer The Liar

listman
"It really doesn't matter, we can't do a thing about it at this point."


Know you've got the cred, - but as we get stronger there's no agreeing with this.

Don't stop fighting, never stop till the fight is done.

Look what the Egyptians & Tunisians are doing without cell lines and no internet.
And in this society a group of union men can't ?
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Re: Spencer The Liar

listman
In reply to this post by bill lebo
 "I didn't think there was much more of a choice."

Thats what they wanted and despite what the UBC  & NY Council has done, WE CAN MITIGATE THE SITUATION.
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Re: Spencer The Liar

listman
In reply to this post by bill lebo
" We always seem to put people in office who are the power brokers and they always seem to be the ones who are the most corrupt.



They can be taken out, xcept those who are the informants. Danielson comes to mind for one.
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Re: Spencer The Liar

listman
In reply to this post by bill lebo
"The candidates who run because they really want to make this a better union and not because they want to stuff their pockets with ill gotten money"

They still exist, start with that.
_________________________

"Anyway, we are under trusteeship so we're going to have to deal with whatever the UBC throws at us."

I know many that won't take this in such cavalier terms.

______________________________________________

Elections, think thats the be all end all cure.  Not at the present.

I for one vbut waitnthere are more who will not accept a newly chartered local with a completley appointed eboard.
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Re: Spencer The Liar

bill lebo
So do something about it. Start with not hiding behind a false moniker.
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Re: Spencer The Liar

listman

I honestly do have the utmost respect !   I don't think you actually could know, if you don't know me.
Maybe someday we'd correct that.

Understand the Monicker, --- Be the Monicker.  Could be part of the proof which gets them out working on it as we speak.

Yes he is a liar.

Unlike the su(e) the name & principal do not denote fear.
The site's purposes are right & good, and I thank U SU. But since the moonstruck guys are on board concentration on forward thinking stewards aleady known is much more appropriate.
They just could have saved us all a shitload of time had they come out earlier, but as we go on................
.

The work presently underway may not be of the heavenly category of testifying to Congress but thus far it has tangibly helped I mean made a difference in individuals lives and awareness of being  played. There's  notice of it by those opposing it and its in face to face mode locally & collectively.
How many regional councils were grouped as one back then ?  Thats happened.
And if the agencies don't listen this time maybe next !  They will.
Maybe a SCOTUS Judge will volunantarily retire and take such a case ?  

So Bill with the utmost respect as I stated before, you just don't know. But I'll go to the mat trying.




One more thing.       Are you out of the game or not calling anyone, cause we've not heard from you ?
Your note sounded pretty defeatist if you don't mind me saying.
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Re: Spencer The Liar

bill lebo
I've gone thru this before. I know what can and can't be accomplished. The best thing that we can do now is to get the membership on a realistic course of action and that takes time. In my local that starts with getting members to meetings. Not an easy task, so I've asked members to go to their jobsites and educate other members or call members they know. It starts small. As they say educate, agitate, and organize. It's not 1995, the system in place has weakened most of the memberships resolve. One post says their is no need for locals, but locals gave us a sense of pride, loyalty and dedication to something  tangible. For many it seems to be difficult to grasp the idea of a unified council. I understand it.I understand that since the inception of the owl and the appointment of BA's the locals became nothing more than ghost locals or social clubs, but the local union still seems to be important. If it wasn't no one would care if Douglas J dissolved their locals but they do. I look to the future, right now I don't think we could muster the members to move on the coucil the way we did in the past and even back then the results were small. The court will side with the RO and quit frankly I think Dennis Walsh will do the best job he can for us. Mike did the best thing that could be done right now by filing for elections, looking to the future. We need to put the cleanest, most uncorruptible man we can find in as EST and I really believe that is Mike Biello. I plan to retire in November and I want someone in there that I know will do the best thing for this membership, so that my, and I say my pension stays secure and this union goes on and gets stronger. If anyone can do something that can stop McCarrons machine that isn't crazy, makes sense, and has the potential of getting something done that will have a positive outcome, I'll be more than happy to do whatever I can to help. But until that comes to pass, I have to be satified with what I'm doing. If you know me as you say you do. you know I put my time in. I spent 6 years fighting the good fight. The members of this council vote for their council officers because of that fight, because of me and two other carpenters who brought that issue to the courts attention. for all the good that did us. This time around we need to put the right man in the seat and keep the crap out. I can't say I'm not bitter that we're back in the same place we were so many years ago. In fact, we're in a worse place (drugs in the council, unbelivable, doing what they did after all we had been through) and in a sense we're in a better place because a guy like Mike Biello has a far better chance than he would have had back then. Anyway that's just how I see things, just my opinion.    
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Re: Spencer The Liar

listman
Relying on voter turnout #'s to get a good man in WILL FAIL. PERIOD.

I wish, I dream,  but more real than Forde doing 11 years is the fact and Walsh quoted the stats, - one half of one % or something like that..
We know Derrico's/.157 cronies are greater in number than that
The vacum which exists, scuse me, they created assures this defeat.
Good luck with that election thing

Unless there's a 9-11 type tragedy like the pension going bust or men loosing 50% or more of their benefits you too must understand the #'s just aren't there.  Unless you put a car in every garage I mean literraly give each voter 20K, - just not gonna happen within the time frame alloted. Don Quijote - "THIS IS AN IMPOSSIBLE DREAM."  

Turnout was terrrible Thurs eve. there wasn't but 500 ( if that ) of 11K men.
Lofty goal putting a good man in ?
Most left when 157 business started. What does that tell you.
No one gives a shit about meetings and there's good reason for that.

What it tells me is men came out for the chance to drill Spencer.
We need more information but Spencer will not any time soon put himself in the position of recieving those volley's members throw at him. So no chance other than accepting a completley appointed eboard------------------NO !


Retired or otherwise you could do better Mr. Lebo, or at most cheer from the sidelines.

If you are made of the right stuff, as I'm slowly loosing this understanding of your particular history in 1999, what happened between then & now, where'd you go, what'd you do, who did it to you, Or did you get a full time gig ? WE WILL NOT FAIL even if we do not get an appointment on Pennsylvania Ave.
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Re: Spencer The Liar

AFFR
Thats why we need a council wide mail-in ballot and an honest guy can win.
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Re: Spencer The Liar

bill lebo
Amen to that
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Re: Spencer The Liar

John D
In reply to this post by AFFR
Mail-in Ballots are the way to go.  It will keep out the organized crime, McCarron included.  Start writing to Judge Berman, Ben Torrance and Dennis Walsh demanding mail-in voting.