“On the Tools” pension and then continue working for the UBC full time?

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“On the Tools” pension and then continue working for the UBC full time?

Bill Walsh
“On the Tools” pension and then continue working for the UBC full time?

If a Council employee can retire at 55, collect their “on the tools” pension and then continue working at the Council full time, why can't a regular pensioner do the same? What's with this 39.5 hour restriction and who sent this threshold?  Now we have restrictions that stop retirees instead of letting them continue to work, teach, provide and contribute while they collect monies that they contributed into over their whole careers.
 
Doug McCarron is currently collecting his on the tools pension as well as others throughout our UBC and working full time.  

We are now penalizing a retiree's who still have the drive to work and turn them away when we need their experience and commitment on job sites. Retirees hold the history about how this union used to be run and methods to keep members concerns fresh. Some would like to see them go away and leave room for 300 Hitters Club and others who will fall in line.

Whenever I work the limited 39.5 monthly hours permitted, I am contributing $14.64 per hour to the Welfare, $117.12 for an 8 hour day, $585.60 per week into the funds, on top of still being charged the premiums.

When a retiree works for the Jobsite Integrity Team, they are permitted to work over the 39.5 limit without a problem and then work a week in the field on the tools. The Council does not take out the welfare contribution and this permits one to work over the limit. Why can’t a retiree work in the field and request the contractor not deduct this welfare contribution of $14.64 and continue to work in the field?

They are double banging the retirees who still choose to work and have been for years. I spoke to the Review Officer and the EST but to no avail. I guess a class action lawsuit will be the only way to get this behavior corrected.
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Re: “On the Tools” pension and then continue working for the UBC full time?

long time gone
" They are double banging the retirees "  They're train'n us( banging)  members up the kazoo Billy. What else is new. We're not indentured servants, but we're constantly being raped and abused. And they put a blindfold, non transparent, on ya b4 they penetrate.
" "
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Re: “On the Tools” pension and then continue working for the UBC full time?

" "
In reply to this post by Bill Walsh
Bill, if you have to ask, you'll never understand that all the carpenters are equal and some carpenters are more equal than the others. If you think that the pension/work exceptions are wrong report it to one of the fist full of anti corruption groups that we are paying while they double and triple dip. Or is it wrong because you aren't getting your share?  
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Re: “On the Tools” pension and then continue working for the UBC full time?

Ethics
In reply to this post by Bill Walsh
As long as a McCarron has anything to do with it, your getting screwed nine ways to Sunday. There is currently nothing right about the carpenters union, only some of the districts are getting less fucked than others, because good men stood up to the bullshit and stopped it . Look round the different district councils in Canada and America, and see for yourself, where the current trend is to tell the tyrant to fuck off, and play right. It only works when enough good men speak out against it.  
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Re: “On the Tools” pension and then continue working for the UBC full time?

Willy Nilly
Boys, Boys, It sure sounds like jealousy to me. The union is corrupt to the hilt and everyone has known this fact for a long time. Trouble is as long as your getting yours, then who cares. Now that your not getting and they are still getting theirs, it's time to cry. All this "we will take care of ourselves" attitude at the top, is what the union has become!
   What ever made you want to retire at 55 and complain that you can't work enough? Don't you see the hypocrisy in that. More, more, I want more!   You sound childish! Give up your retirement and go back full time.......dummy.  
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Re: “On the Tools” pension and then continue working for the UBC full time?

Bill K
In reply to this post by " "
smiley your a little bitch. Bill Walsh is a stand up guy. You on the other hand are a sex worker at the dc. Trying to satisfy anyone who you think will elevate your status. The good news is the people who work at the dc are as low down as you so keep gagging.
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Re: “On the Tools” pension and then continue working for the UBC full time?

retired 157 steward
Its sounds fucked up but we all retire for our own reasons some are more fortunate than others I know i'll collect more than I ever put in by the time I'm 65 if I reach that age you guys think your a fireman or cop or sanitation worker with their unbelievable pensions thank god we got what we got I know its not enough but that's the choice we made stop being a bitch
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Re: “On the Tools” pension and then continue working for the UBC full time?

Daniel J. Franco

If you want to thank 'God' for something, thank 'God' for P.J. McGuire and fellow carpenters for 'bitching'.

It's only because people 'bitch', stand their ground, and push against oppression and injustice do we have our unions.

Its sounds fucked up but we all retire for our own reasons some are more fortunate than others I know i'll collect more than I ever put in by the time I'm 65 if I reach that age you guys think your a fireman or cop or sanitation worker with their unbelievable pensions thank god we got what we got I know its not enough but that's the choice we made stop being a bitch


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NAML
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Re: “On the Tools” pension and then continue working for the UBC full time?

Norman
The problem is that today carpenters 'bitch' but they don't stand their ground, and push against oppression and injustice we have our unions. We need more concerted action and less complaining; don't you agree that's what real union people, like P. J. McGuire, had im mind?
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Re: “On the Tools” pension and then continue working for the UBC full time?

RichardDorrough
This post was updated on .
In reply to this post by Bill Walsh
Bill Walsh. Though the UBC constitution declares that a retiree may not work, hold office or be on a committee when collecting a UBC pension the UBC International has declared, and we have multiple letters to prove it, that the reference ONLY applies to an UBC International pension. Therefore ANY retiree can old office, work full time for the UBC ,be on committees and etc. while collecting ANY pension but a UBC International Pension. Your pension plan cannot legally give a s.. what the UBC Constitution says.
       
        Your problem is that the UBC and your pension fund are totally separate entity's and the UBC has no control(is not legally supposed to anyways) over what your particular pension funds rules are. Any decision on who collects and who does not or any OTHER action cannot be decided by the UBC but by the funds trustees. That is why the UBC has directed the councils, at least the Empire and Northeast, to create a bylaw that says the EST of the council can appoint or remove all trustees on any fund in its jurisdiction. This is also illegal unless the fund trustees vote to include the wording in the fund rules.
     
              They have seated trustees who will vote their way when it comes time for mergers or funneling(and locking it up so they cannot use it to supply members benefits) money into the UBC loan program and removed ones who will not. This is also  illegal. John Fuchs of the Empire Council spent 3 years and millions in court trying to get the Feds to allow that on a small upstate fund who had a rule in its plan documents that stated "To be a trustee a person must have been a member of the fund for the previous 3 years" This enraged Fuchs and the UBC because the courts told them to f.. off and they lost.
     
       The point is the plan trustees, documents and rules supersede anything the UBC or council declares. So it is not the UBC or council preventing you from working full time it is your pension fund rules. Tell me. Does your plan rules have specific language that allows council employees the right to collect their pension while working?? If not why have your fund trustees not stopped their pensions. It is right now being alleged that in Federal District Court that Doug McCarron had John Decarlo write a special addendum to the plan rules so he could collect his pension. The Fuchs case and this action should prove to all that it is the fund rules and ONLY the fund rules that allow or deny your right to work and collect your pension. If there is no wording in your plan rules that allows those Council employees to work full time “In the Industry” and the trustees are allowing them toi collect then they are in breach of their fiduciary duty and due diligence . If these council employees never had to sign the “I will not work in the industry” agreement you had to sign then the fund is discriminating against you.
       
       Three weeks after McCarron announced on camera that he was collecting his pension we got a notice from our Pension fund. That notice said that all retirees could now work FULL TIME in as supervisory position for any signatory contractor and collect their full pension. This means foreman, general foreman and supervisors although I am sure they meant it to apply only to ‘Position as a Supervisor” They refuse to tell us who introduced this proposed rule ,when it was voted on and who voted. We are trying to find out how many other Pension funds added this rule.
 
       If you think about it just a little I am sure you will conclude that if you really want to work full time and be retired you will do so.
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Re: “On the Tools” pension and then continue working for the UBC full time?

🍺
Thank you Richard
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Re: “On the Tools” pension and then continue working for the UBC full time?

The White Wizard
In reply to this post by Bill Walsh
The new letter being sent to members as of 10/2/14 states that a retired member can work his  monthly 39.5 hours and not be penalized on his retire pension. A new rule starting 12/1/14 states he will lose his welfare retiree benefits for LIFE if he works even 1 hour a month for 3 months in disqualifying employment covered under carpenter jurisdiction agreement . The 39.5 hours we do now are under the same disqualifying employment. How the heck is this possible??????????
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Re: “On the Tools” pension and then continue working for the UBC full time?

RichardDorrough
What plan is this.Remember this plan is YOURS. The Trustees work for YOU. I am sure not a single Plan participant agrees with something so absurd and a blatant attempt to cheat members of their pension. This change had to be voted on by the trustees.Under ERISA law every plan participant has a right to view all plan documents. Demand to see them. ERISA Tile 1 Disclosure requirements..Find out who introduced this wording . When it was voted on and who voted and how. Gather the plan participants. Get signatures demanding this be rescinded and call for a vote of the Trustees. Send it certified to the Plan administer and all trustees. if they refuse sue the shit out of them
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Re: “On the Tools” pension and then continue working for the UBC full time?

TomMcGuire
In reply to this post by The White Wizard
by disqualifying employment they mean, and I think the letter says it, work that is covered under jurisdictional rules for a non signatory. Meaning working for a non union company, within the jurisdiction of the NYCDCC, if that helps. Apparently there are members who have retired and are getting pension and healthcare who have gone to work non union in NY and NJ. They seem to have found a way (legal????????) to go after the guy's who do that. I seem to remember a spirited discussion here about guy's going to work non union after retiring and I think this is the DC's attack on that. But is it legal????? They can't take your pension, that's clear if you work non union after retiring, but can they really take your healthcare that you paid for???  Again, they are talking non signatories, but is it legal?????
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Re: “On the Tools” pension and then continue working for the UBC full time?

Sick
In reply to this post by Bill Walsh
The problem with your whole scenario is that no one is happy with the fact that the council reps can, and do, double dip. This does not mean that we want any self serving prick who is constantly whining about how tough they haves it to be able to drain our pension while we are working in the field. Just so that we are clear billy, to those of us who are not constantly scheming about how to enrich ourselves at everyone else's expense, retired means they are not working anymore, if you are working full time, then you are not retired, and no, you should not be able to collect a pension while you are working full time.
Let me put it another way, maybe if when Hanley was sending you to all the plum jobs where all you had to do was show up, if you had just put in the effort and shown up, then you would have more hours and you would have a bigger pension. I do understand how hard it is for you, because after a lifetime of being a self serving prick, you are not now going to suddenly realize that the whole world doesn't revolve around you.
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Re: “On the Tools” pension and then continue working for the UBC full time?

Brody Martin
In reply to this post by Bill Walsh
Placing personal differences and motives aside, if a member has satisfied the requirements to collect a pension what difference does it make what he or she chooses to do ? They have fulfilled their obligation with the years of service and contributions, they are not draining the pension fund, they are collecting what they are entitled to. Most of us who are in our mid-fifties and have the time in want to get out, however , if we choose to supplement our income I think that is our business. What other organization exercises this type of control of peoples lives ? We worked, we put our time, we are retired from the trade. If you want to come back and get a week a month, so be it. If yo wanted to work at your convenance and pace ( being you are retired ) that should be beyond the control of the NYCDC.
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Re: “On the Tools” pension and then continue working for the UBC full time?

Bill Walsh
In reply to this post by Sick

Mr. Sick.......if you had the courage to lecture to me in person like in your anonymous post, I would deal with you, like a man. The only thing here that is "sick" is your lack of speaking the truth and being stuck in your Hanley time warp. I feel sorry for people like you who can't come out from behind the computer screen and consider things in a way that could maybe benefit "all" members. You have zero credibility and no one takes you seriously. Good luck Mr. Sick.....by the way, you picked a perfect anonymous name, now go and get some help.
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Re: “On the Tools” pension and then continue working for the UBC full time?

Sick
I am considering  things in a way that could maybe benefit "all" members, and not just you Billy.
 you were given cushy jobs all your life and now are trying to put it up that you should be entitled to work full time and collect a pension, yes that would be draining the funds, the pension fund is not some bottomless pit, when you take money out the fund shrinks, and that does not benefit all of the members, that just helps you billy.  you never did nothing for no one,  I am sick and tired of hearing you whine, if you cannot afford to retire, tough shit, go back to work. Just because you hit retirement age, does not mean all the rules should be changed to put money in your pocket, you never cried about this until you hit 55 and suddenly everything should be different. the pension rules have not changed, all that has changed is if they changed the rules now it would benefit you. so why don't YOU consider things in a way that could maybe benefit "all" members AND NOT JUST YOURSELF
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Re: “On the Tools” pension and then continue working for the UBC full time?

Bill Walsh
Mr. Sick.......if you had the courage to lecture to me in person like in your anonymous post, I would deal with you, like a man. The only thing here that is "sick" is your lack of speaking the truth and being stuck in your Hanley time warp. I feel sorry for people like you who can't come out from behind the computer screen and consider things in a way that could maybe benefit "all" members. You have zero credibility and no one takes you seriously. Good luck Mr. Sick.....by the way, you picked a perfect anonymous name, now go and get some help. Still no credibility for poor old Mr. Sick.