Blue Card is illegal

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Blue Card is illegal

Robert Kwiecinski
Unless the membership voted for this program in a secret ballot election this program is illegal. Under LMRDA 101(3)(A) ANY INCREASE IN DUES MUST BE VOTED ON BY THE MEMBERSHIP. The fines that are/were paid are actually dues assesments/working dues. So unless this program was voted in by the general membership it has been done illegally. Any money that was collected under this program should be returned to the membership plus interest. You as members should proceed to hire an attorney to bring this case before a judge to regain the illegal money taken from you. Sheet Metal Workers VS. Lynn 488 US 347  /29USC412
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Re: Blue Card is illegal

CUCKOO
Read the whole thing. We fall under (B)

(3) DUES, INITIATION FEES, AND ASSESSMENTS.-- Except in the case of a federation of national or international labor organizations, the rates of dues and initiation fees payable by members of any labor organization in effect on the date of enactment of this Act shall not be increased, and no general or special assessment shall be levied upon such members, except-
 
(A) in the case of a local organization, (i) by majority vote by secret ballot of the members in good standing voting at a general or special membership meeting, after reasonable notice of the intention to vote upon such question, or (ii) by majority vote of the members in good standing voting in a membership referendum conducted by secret ballot; or
 
(B) in the case of a labor organization, other than a local labor organization or a federation of national or international labor organizations, (i) by majority vote of the delegates voting at a regular convention, or at a special convention of such labor organization held upon not less than thirty days' written notice to the principal office of each local or constituent labor organization entitled to such notice, or (ii) by majority vote of the members in good standing of such labor organization voting in a membership referendum conducted by secret ballot, or (iii) by majority vote of the members of the executive board or similar governing body of such labor organization, pursuant to express authority contained in the constitution and bylaws of such labor organization: Provided, That such action on the part of the executive board or similar governing body shall be effective only until the next regular convention of such labor organization.
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Re: Blue Card is illegal

Robert Kwiecinski
You fall under 101 (3) (A) thats a fact. Local 157 is a local organization. This is a local level issue it effects you on a local level. This money was not collected as international dues . The money was collected from the local members and the money stayed in the locals hands.
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Re: Blue Card is illegal

CUCKOO
Your wrong.  The blue card has nothing to do with 157.  It is an assesment of the DC an intermediate body.  And therefore it only has to hald a special convention of the Delegates this was addressed  by Judge Haight about 5 or 6 years ago.  The money is collected by the DC and stays in the hands of the DC.  You obviviously are not a member of the NYCDCC or you would know that.  Before I continue this conversation with you what Council are you from?
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Re: Blue Card is illegal

CUCKOO
In reply to this post by Robert Kwiecinski
If thats a fact then cut and paste section 101(3)(a) and post you facts.  I cut and paste the section of the LMRDA that is the Facts.  If you have it post it and prove me wrong.  But I'm positive I'm not wrong just for the fact that you kept referring to 157.  The blue card has nothing to do with 157.
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Re: Blue Card is illegal

the reaper
In reply to this post by Robert Kwiecinski
Anyone that signed the Blue Card should be brought up on charges!!!
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Re: Blue Card is illegal

??????????
What if you signed it with a note of protest on it ?
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Re: Blue Card is illegal

Robert Kwiecinski
Even though you belong to a international union,you are being charged the dues/fine on a local basis, therefore it is a local issue 101(3)(A). The plan is being implemented on a local basis. This plan does not exist everywhere internationally. The fines/dues are not the same across the country. This is a local issue.
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Re: Blue Card is illegal

Robert Kwiecinski
In reply to this post by CUCKOO
Did Judge Haight Sign off on the program ? If so lets see the proof, post the document. And if he did sign off on it did he know that he broke the LMRDA 101(3)(A) ?
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Re: Blue Card is illegal

CUCKOO
Post LMRDA 101(3)(a)
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Re: Blue Card is illegal

Robert Kwiecinski
cukoo, you posted it already you moron. Look at your post earlier. 101(3)(A)
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Re: Blue Card is illegal

Robert Kwiecinski
 caselaw to support the issue SHEETMETAL WORKERS VS. LYNN 488US347   / &   29USC412   READ THE CASES AND UNDERSTAND.
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Re: Blue Card is illegal

Robert Kwiecinski
http://supreme.justia.com/us/488/347             look under Page 488US348       look at (b)    look down read : As petitioners concede, the imposition of a trusteeship does not destroy the criticle right to vote on dues increases which Title I guarentees to local union members.
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Re: Blue Card is illegal

Robert Kwiecinski
Time to get your BLUE CARD money back plus interest.
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Re: Blue Card is illegal

Robert Kwiecinski
http://supreme.justia.com/us/488/347             Page 488U.S.357  Section 101(a)(3) of Title I 29 U.S.C. 411(a) (3), guarentees to the members of a local union the right to vote on any dues increases.   The fine for the BLUE CARD is structured as a dues assesment, so since the membership had no direct vote for this program it is illegal. Since they implemented the program with out membership ratification, any fines/dues  were collected illegally, and therefore the members who were fined should have this money returned to them plus interest. Good Luck
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Re: Blue Card is illegal

AFFR
Bob I have 4 points that I believe are accurate. Please answer each one seperatly.

1.  It is a fact that the blue card is a method of collection and has nothing to do with the imposition of the assesments.  I believe the it is illegal for assesments to be collected through the benefit funds via. the vacation fund.  But the fact of the matter is the actual blue card and the assesments themselves are 2 seperate issues.

2.  Niether the blue card or the assesments were imposed or approved while the District Council was under a trusteeship.  Therefore your arguement under  http://supreme.justia.com/us/488/347  page 488 U.S. 357 is not valid.

3.  The District Council is not a Local organization or a national or international labor organizations.  It is an Intermediate body and therfore fall under 29 USC 411 (3) (b):
(B) in the case of a labor organization, other than a local labor organization or a federation of national or international labor organizations, (i) by majority vote of the delegates voting at a regular convention, or at a special convention of such labor organization held upon not less than thirty days' written notice to the principal office of each local or constituent labor organization entitled to such notice, or (ii) by majority vote of the members in good standing of such labor organization voting in a membership referendum conducted by secret ballot, or (iii) by majority vote of the members of the executive board or similar governing body of such labor organization, pursuant to express authority contained in the constitution and bylaws of such labor organization: Provided, That such action on the part of the executive board or similar governing body shall be effective only until the next regular convention of such labor organization.

4.  You say. " The fine for the BLUE CARD is structured as a dues assesment."  I believe you are talking about the $500 picketing credit.  If so this $500 was an approved assesment under 101 (3) (b) by a special convention of the delegates.  The delegates then approved a $500 credit for any member who picketed.

5.  Are you a member of the NYCDCC?

Now Bob do me a favor don't cherry pick what you want to respond for the sole benefit of your arguement in an effort to cause confusion by you.  Respond to my points 1-5 and number your responses 1-5 if you want to maintain any credibilty.
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Re: Blue Card is illegal

AFFR
Bob post link to Sheet Metal workers v Lynn.  For my reading pleasure and so I can understand your arguement.  
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Re: Blue Card is illegal

Robert Kwiecinski
AFFR (Villiage Idiot)  Here is the link again moron. Read the full document and understand      http://supreme.justia.com/us/488/347
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Re: Blue Card is illegal

Robert Kwiecinski
You vote on dues increases on a local level even though you belong to an intermediate body and an international union. When an increase of dues is brought forward to the membership it is done at local meetings. There it is dicussed, and there it should be voted on by secret ballot by the membership. Any way else is illegal. Delegates cannot vote on this for the membership under the LMRDA 101 (3)(A) it must be direct membership secret ballot vote. Your dues are charged locally, you are a member of local 157 , your dues are recorded as John Doe member  local 157.
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Re: Blue Card is illegal

AFFR
Well I think most people can see you are the Idiot here.  Once again you refuse to respond directly to my points 1-5.  Obviviously you cant.  Can you simply reply to points 1-5 and list your responses 1-5 I would think that would be pretty simple for a guy that thinks he knows it all.

Once again you refuse to acknoledge 101 (3) (b).  Can you expain exactly what 101(3)(b) means to you.  They didn't just write it for the fun of it.  We are not a Local we are not an International we ARE an intermediate body.

Dues are the only thing charged and collected by the Locals and are infact voted on at the local.  The assesments that pertain to the blue card are charged and collected directly by the District Council the Locals have nothing to do with the assesments.  Further the Locals do not recieve any of the money from the assesments.

Now stop dancing around all the topics I have put before you and answer them point by point.  If not it proves you have no credibilty and you are just spreading propaganda for your own personal agenda.  Which I am begining to believe has to do with Carpenters Local 1 and or Amalgamated Carpenters and that asshole Richard Dorrough.  

ARE YOU A MEMBER OF THE NYCDCC?    
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