They have a whole lot nothing on thier website. They don't address any of the most important issues that would be detrimental to the starting and survival of a new union. I cannot vote yes in good faith just because I hate McCarron without answers to these questions UPFRONT.... Pensions? 401Ks? Lifetime Medical For Retirees? Medical Plan? AnnuityPlan? Vacation Plan? Job Security? Political Action? Training Center for Journeymen and Apprentices? Wages/Collective Bargaining Agreement? What about dues and assesments to fund and operate the new Union? What about affiliations with the Building Trades, AFL-CIO and IUPAT? I AM VOTING NO IF THIER IS NO LONG TERM VISION FOR THIS NEW UNION. AT LEAST NOW I KNOW MY FAMILIES FUTURE. WE NEED ANSWERS BEFORE THE VOTE OR AMALGAMATED WILL LOSE. http://democracyfordockbuilders.com/ This website is filled with Propaganda and Lies but Lacks Answers, Facts and most of all the Truth
NO ANSWERS==NO VOTE
WHEN READING THE REPLIES TO THIS POST TAKE NOTICE THE AMALGALIARS WILL NOT DIRECTLY ANSWER ANY OF THE QUESTIONS I POSED TO THEM........THEY WILL REPLY WITH HATRED, PROPAGANDA AND LIES ! ! !
DEMAND ANSWERS--------DEMAND FACTS-------DEMAND TRUTH
Do you really think you and your family have a Future with the NYCDCC? You must be living under a rock , all the questions you are asking have already been answered. And it is now time to make a decision. You can stay with the dysfunctional NYCDCC or start a new union. One where you have a voice and a vote.
The guy asked some legitimate questions and rather than answering them you tell him they have already been answered and tell him he must be living under a rock! You don't win votes like that my friend. How about answering his questions the best you can to help him and the rest of the members (like myself and many I know) decide if they want to put their future and their families future on the line? Your attitude and answer is exactly what many members are concerned with!
The Future is in your hands. YOU WILL BE VOTING on all the questions you asked. You and all the other good dockbuilders will determine your future. A YES vote is your future, otherwise you are comitted to McCarronism with NO future.
You must be a carpenter, that has one of those NYCDC plum jobs. Why does the NYCDC want the dockbuilders to stay with the UBC ? What have they done for us ?? Disolved the best local in the NYCDC, that's all.
Will the new Independently formed local Union for the DOCKIES be allowed to retain their Property (Land, Building's, FF & E etc.) and hold Title to same in the names of the non-profit Corporation & Board of Trustees & Officers (duly elected via secret ballot) and as properly recorded under the laws of New York State? YES or NO
The same question is applicable to all Benefit Trust Funds and assets therein...YES or NO?
Dockbuilder: The Dockbuilders don't own any property, buildings, etc, All the office property and furnishings,were confiscated by McCarroon. He also stole the 3.5 Million treasury. All Trustees and Officers wil be newly ELECTED by the members of the Independent Amalgamated Dockbuilders.
Non-Responsive reply. Doug bad, We Good....uggh! I do not want a caveman answer. Answer the Question? YES or NO.
Let me me pose it another way....
You own a home and you Pay the Mortgage for 30-years....but I outwit you and force you to assign all rights in the Title to land & buildings (your home), the very second you make the last payment...or better still, the day you close? Will you sign that Contract with me today?
If you will, please find me 1,000 more like you & I will lease the appropriate Convention Hall so you can all "come on down" & sign your life & assets away and hand me the Key.
p.s. I'll throw in a nice buffet and open bar. Those underwater will be summarily rejected from this once in a lifetime opportunity. We only accept the best of the best, so I want properties with a min. of 75% equity which are in above average condition. Are you in the Game?
b) Assign your Property Rights to another International Trade Union which is affiliated with the AFL-CIO, who are hellbent on getting their hands on the Benefit Trust Fund Assets of the UBC as their primary goal?
c) Your definitive rights under the NLRA, LMRA, LMRDA and the Consent Decree for the return of Local Union autonomy and full restoration of democracy?
d) 25-30% of your weekly pay, plus benefit losses to an unknown entity?
After responding to a-d above, would you feel that in so doing you have achieved a victory against McCarron or the UBCJA and would you sleep better at night knowing that once broken away in the fashion described by those advocating for this departure - that the new International could do the exact same thing (under cover of darkness of course)?
What does autonomy mean to you? Define it? Are you autonomous in your home...let me re-phrase that, does your wife allow you to believe that when you get in from work?
Ted the property is lost under the UBC constitution. There is no way to get it back unless you buy it back like the canadians did. They paid the UBC 11 million for their property. That was decided in a canadian court.
The AFL-CIO is not hell-bent on getting their hands on any funds. If you start a new union up you have total control of your funds as per your agreement with who you affiliate with. The funds will stay seperate and in control of the members of the new local
"If you start a new union up you have total control of your funds as per your agreement with who you affiliate with. The funds will stay seperate and in control of the members of the new local " Based on WHAT do up make this statement..Your opinion and not fact so dont act like it is fact G
"Ted, you should understand that the affiliation will not cause the new union to be under control of the sponsoring international. The new union will act independantly and sovereignly." All this you base on the posted affiliation agreement. Tell me wrote this agreement Robert. Will the other Carpenters the IUPAT are going after going to have the same one. Is this the standard agreement for the Resolution 70 charters. This agreement was written for the Amalgamated carpenters and Joiners and the IUPAT.Is it now standard for all locals. This agreement was written for a group by a lawyer who is interested in preserving the best interests of the Amlagamated what ever the fuck they are whether for good or personal reasons. The rest of these groups so far while have PAID IUPAT lawyers as you did ..How do you assume to know what these lawyers will write when first abnd foremost their job as was declared by our IUPAT lawyer is to serve the IUPAT
" There will be a new carpenters international formed once this goes nationwide"NO THERE WILL NOT.. That was the intent right up until the Carpenters were forced to affiliate with another trade. As long as they are affiliated with another trade there will be Your candy coating this when you have no clue what the outcome will be the attempted unaffliation will be and you have never seen the affiliation or unaffilation terms in the AFL-CIO Carpenters Charter bylaws. Right now according to the rules of the Resolution 70 Charter the IUPAT can revoke the charter of the Amalgamated what ever the fuck they are at their discretion. What happens if this solid gold affiliation agreement you pointing to is presented to IUPAT "saying we have a 30 day out clause" and IUPAT says then under the AFL-CIO rules we can revoke your charter. Think they wont do it. Bullshit. We refused to affiliate and thats exactly what they did and further blocked our rights under their own rules for a General Presidents review