ATTENTION ALL CONSTITUTIONAL & PARLIAMENTARY EXPERTS

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ATTENTION ALL CONSTITUTIONAL & PARLIAMENTARY EXPERTS

John Musumeci
Administrator
This post was updated on .
All you legal eagles and future UBC Leaders, answer all of the below questions correctly and Win a Prize!

Background

The officers of a Local Union executive committee are made up of ten elected members: President, Vice President, Recording Secretary, Financial Secretary, Treasurer, Warden, Conductor, and 3 Trustees.

Sometime before the start of a regular schedule meeting both the president and vice president resign, leaving the two officer positions vacant.

On the day of the meeting the recording secretary, financial secretary and one trustee were absent, leaving only 5 executive committee members present for the start of the meeting. The meeting is attended by 130 members and they are unaware of the vacated positions and absent executive committee members.

Questions

1. Who open’s the meeting and what should that person say?

2. How are the vacated officer positions filled?

3. Who should record the meeting minutes?

4. Who is in charge of the Local Union the next business day?

(Note: Please explain your answers. The above example resembles Monday's LU 157 meeting.)
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Re: ATTENTION ALL CONSTITUTIONAL & PARLIAMENTARY EXPERTS

listman
Does this make sense to anyone, -Rules were changed to help save us from McCarron !
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Re: ATTENTION ALL CONSTITUTIONAL & PARLIAMENTARY EXPERTS

RichardDorrough
In reply to this post by John Musumeci
1. Who open’s the meeting and what should that person say?
Any eboard member opens the meeting and calls for a PERMANENT Pro Tem President Vote election under32D and picks or assigns somebody the duties of recording Sec.

2. How are the vacated officer positions filled?
The vacated Pres spot is filed by vote of the members present under 32D. The New Pro Tem Pres can then fill the vacated offices at "his discretion" under 32b

3. Who should record the meeting minutes?A recording Secretary is picked from any member who can handle it for the meeting by the Pro tem Pres.It is usually a member of the eboard

4. Who is in charge of the Local Union the next business day?The Pro Tem President and anybody he picks to fill vacated Offices under 32b

(Note: Please explain your answers)
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Re: ATTENTION ALL CONSTITUTIONAL & PARLIAMENTARY EXPERTS

RichardDorrough
Are you gong to grade us and where was your answer sheet created??Mr Quinn I assume
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Re: ATTENTION ALL CONSTITUTIONAL & PARLIAMENTARY EXPERTS

RichardDorrough
In reply to this post by John Musumeci
Here is a quiz. A cripple walked down the isle and the TV Evangelist waited. The TV Jesus said if you believe throw down one crutch and he did so yelling "save us". The TV Jesus said again "do you believe" and if you do throw down the other crutch. And the cripple did so yelling "save us"
 Do you know what happened. He fell flat on his face and broke his nose. He was a cripple you moron and working with a TV Jesus . Moral beware of the TV Jesus and those that just want to believe
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Re: ATTENTION ALL CONSTITUTIONAL & PARLIAMENTARY EXPERTS

RichardDorrough
In reply to this post by John Musumeci
There is an old saying. If it looks like shit, feels like shit,smells like shit and tastes like shit....
Wait the moral is not "it is shit".
 
The moral is which one of you f....ing idiots want to believe so bad you touched and ate shit to see if it was real.
Does Walsh wear sandals and has he ever sold you miracle spring water on an infomercial with a real ugly middle aged woman
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Re: ATTENTION ALL CONSTITUTIONAL & PARLIAMENTARY EXPERTS

Pat Nee
In reply to this post by RichardDorrough
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Re: ATTENTION ALL CONSTITUTIONAL & PARLIAMENTARY EXPERTS

RichardDorrough
As I said Pat.. Not a clue..You explained nothing. You stated your opinion and managed to pull off a scam last night.What you pulled last night jeopardizes us all and is a disservice to the UBC rank and file.
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Re: ATTENTION ALL CONSTITUTIONAL & PARLIAMENTARY EXPERTS

RichardDorrough
In reply to this post by Pat Nee
Directly due to your actions Local 157 has no President or VP this morning to work to protect the members.The Financial Sec is supposedly vacationing. So who is running the 157 Local or does it suit you that nobody is as it serves the UBC quite well. Under which bylaw did you run for Recording Sec last night or do you need more time to create more BS. Which "Grey Area" allows Bilello or Gausman to attend eboard meetings and pretend to be Pres and Vp.Quote the section. If by your own BS that you "Explained"they have no power outside the meeting. What you did last night makes Derrico look like a boyscout. If you cant find a rule to support you agenda you make it up as you did last night. Isnt that a Forde and Spencer move which you claim to detest so much
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Re: ATTENTION ALL CONSTITUTIONAL & PARLIAMENTARY EXPERTS

Pat Nee
I  did not have Gerry removed, Dennis Walsh did and I did not talk to Walsh or Ballantyne about it.
 The Eboard is running local 157.  

Section 31 A  page 33 UBC Constitution.  


In elections held to fill vacancies, a member who holds
an office must resign said office in writing before accepting nomination
as a candidate for another office in the same subordinate body
(unless the offices are combined by dispensation) and all existing
vacancies, including those left by such resignations, shall be filled by
the same nominations and election.


The “grey area” as you called it would have been a misinterpretation of the constitution by Ballantyne which led the Eboard to believe that Gausman was a bona fide officer.
What exactly are you claiming I did?
I think that the problem here is that you are attempting to comment on something you know nothing about, you were not there, you have no idea as to what really happened and yet you are trying to pretend that you have a clue.
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Re: ATTENTION ALL CONSTITUTIONAL & PARLIAMENTARY EXPERTS

RichardDorrough
Walsh had no right to remove anybody outside his veto rights.

31A has nothing to do with what you pulled at the meeting. If you trying to use it to explain how you got to be recording Sec you know less than I first anticipated

"The “grey area” as you called it would have been a misinterpretation of the constitution by Ballantyn" this is pure BS fabricated by you

"you were not there, you have no idea as to what really happened" I dont need to be there. I talked to 4 different sources all much more reliable than you. They had no agenda

What you id was screw the members out of a President for 157 with you meeting only and no power outside the meeting spew. You have already read the letter signed by McCarron and still push these lies. Even though Walsh announced Derrico is out as Pres of 157 you still say he is President.
 I knew you were not off to bed but had to run away to avoid the heat
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Re: ATTENTION ALL CONSTITUTIONAL & PARLIAMENTARY EXPERTS

RichardDorrough
In reply to this post by John Musumeci
John,
 When will you grade our papers
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Re: ATTENTION ALL CONSTITUTIONAL & PARLIAMENTARY EXPERTS

John Musumeci
Administrator
Rich: Papers will be graded when I receive the official answers from the UBC. Also here is part of a letter from GP McCarron dated March, 10, 2010 addressing the subject of pro tem appointments.

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Re: ATTENTION ALL CONSTITUTIONAL & PARLIAMENTARY EXPERTS

RichardDorrough
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Re: ATTENTION ALL CONSTITUTIONAL & PARLIAMENTARY EXPERTS

bill lebo
In reply to this post by John Musumeci
     Lets start simple:Section 31 A States; "The officers of a local union SHALL BE (emphasis added) a president, vice president, recording secretary, financial secretary, treasurer, conductor, warden, and three trustees." So a local in order to function as a local must have these positions unless dispensation is granted by the locals bylaws which must be approved by the General Vice President is granted to combine two of the positions.
    Furthermore it is important to note that under STANDING DECISIONS OF THE GENERAL EXECUTIVE BOARD 1887 FEBRUARY 15, it states; "A union not holding meetings at least once a month forfeits its charter and is not eligible for donations.

    Further down the same section it is stated; " In elections to fill vacancies.......and all existing vacancies, including those left by such resignations (in this case vetoes) shall be filled by the same nominations and election.

    Next under: VACANCIES IN LOCAL AND COUNCIL OFFICES; Section 32 B, It states; "When vacancies occur in any elective office of a local union, the president of the local union MAY (emphasis added) appoint a qualified member to fill the vacancy protem, UNTIL SUCH TIME AS AN ELECTION IS HELD TO FILL THE VACANCY(emphasis added). If no executive-secretary-treasurer exists or such position is vacant, the president of the council may make such protem appointment.

      I would infer from this that in the case of a local it would be the vice president making the protem  appointment, because at the council level the president is second in command.

     It is important to note here, that past practice has shown through letters from the General President , that pro tem offices can be held long as 6 months and in some cases it has been longer. This is usually done to spare the local the cost of an interim election when a regularly scheduled election  is close.

     Then section 32 D states; In the absence of both the president and vice president, the recording secretary SHALL (emphasis added) call the meeting to order and those present SHALL (emphasis added) elect a president pro tem.

     So all that being said, your first question was, who opens the meeting and what should that person say?

     There is no president  (vetoed), there is no vice president (retired), the recording secretary, financial secretary and one trustee are absent.
   
     2 position are permanently vacant, 3 are absent therefore temporarily vacant.

     The next highest position would be one of the trustees, I would say the trustee with the most senority. That would be the person who should open the meeting. That trustee should explain to the members the present the situation at hand and refer to sections 31A and 32D of the UBC constitution.

Your next question was how are those vacancies filled?

     The trustee at chair should call for an election of the 2 permanently vacant offices of president and vice president and chair said election. Once said election is held the president protem should then appoint the rest of the positions pro tem with qualified members from the members at the meeting.

Your next question was, who should record the meeting minutes?
     
     That would be whoever the president pro tem appointed to the recording secretary pro tem position.

     Your next question was, who is in charge of the local union the next business day?

     That would be the president pro tem, vice president pro tem, and the rest of the elected executive committee. If the positions who were not there the night of the meeting remain absent or refuse to work with the president pro tem the president pro tem should bring in the appointed positions to fill the continuing vacancies and try to resolve the problem in the interim so that the local can function.

     We have to remember the local union and its members come first and the locals business must be taken care of regardless of agendas and egos.

      Also the reason I emphasised SHALL and MAY is because they are very specific words. When a document says shall there is no leeway, that is the way it is and there's no other way. When it says MAY there is a choice.
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Re: ATTENTION ALL CONSTITUTIONAL & PARLIAMENTARY EXPERTS

chris
In reply to this post by John Musumeci
The answer to all these questions can be answered at 6 am at your participating home depot parking lots were we all will be heading if these locals dont get there act together.
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Re: ATTENTION ALL CONSTITUTIONAL & PARLIAMENTARY EXPERTS

bill lebo
In reply to this post by bill lebo
Sorry I misread. The treasurer would open the meeting and call for the election.
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Re: ATTENTION ALL CONSTITUTIONAL & PARLIAMENTARY EXPERTS

John Musumeci
Administrator
This post was updated on .
In reply to this post by listman
listman:you said..."Does this make sense to anyone, -Rules were changed to help save us from McCarron!"

How does violating the rules "save us from McCarron?"  Read the article I just posted and then answer the four questions.

(John's Note: After posting the article this morning, I received an email message from Review Officer Dennis Walsh at 6:11 am, which he said was distributed on Thursday, April 21st to the executive committee.)

To the Executive Committee of Local 157, Gerard Gausman, and Michael Bilello:

On Tuesday, I asked the UBC to inform me of its interpretation of Section 32 of the UBC Constitution.

I was advised yesterday that if a local union president is absent at a meeting, Section 32 vests the full authority of the local union president in the president pro tem selected at said meeting and that if such president pro tem fills a vacancy such as local union vice president at said meeting, the appointee is to be regarded as the vice president until such time as an election must be held. As currently applicable to Local Union 157, Gerard Gausman is thus the vice-president of the Local until an elected vice-president is installed.

As a result, Mr. Gausman’s appointment by President Pro Tem Michael Bilello on March 21, 2011 (when Lawrence D’Errico was still the President of the Local), and service as vice-president will be immediately reviewed by my office pursuant to Paragraph 5.b of the Stipulation and Order.

Dennis M. Walsh
Review Officer
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Re: ATTENTION ALL CONSTITUTIONAL & PARLIAMENTARY EXPERTS

listman
JM I don't have to answer the questions to know the rules were tweeked more than once as to the Pro tem appts.  Not condoning it but the results still stand just like the contempt 67/33 wrong.  Unless someone files a complaint w/a Fed. Agency these results will stand.
Derrico didn't have the right to continiously make JM's motion dissapear either but it took half a year to reverse that.

If Billelo's conducting business, and there was direct question of this authority to do this, just how long will it take for that to be undone. And what will be undone. Would it throw us further into chaos then the eagle lands and eats the weakened fish.

The question I posed wasn't so much one geared to right or wrong but in looking to the thought of McCarron walking in & taking control if something wasn't done as Walsh put, -to provide for a sense of continuity.

That's all I was looking for.
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Re: ATTENTION ALL CONSTITUTIONAL & PARLIAMENTARY EXPERTS

RichardDorrough
In reply to this post by John Musumeci
I was advised yesterday that if a local union president is absent at a meeting, Section 32 vests the full authority of the local union president in the president pro tem selected at said meeting and that if such president pro tem fills a vacancy such as local union vice president at said meeting, the appointee is to be regarded as the vice president until such time as an election must be held. As currently applicable to Local Union 157, Gerard Gausman is thus the vice-president of the Local until an elected vice-president is installed.

And as such now that Derrico is officially out Gausman is President Pro tem of 157 under Section 34.

Now thanks to you people who ran "this for the meeting scam" you have got the UBC to issue an official ruling to satisfy their agenda which screws the rest of us. Before you started this shit we had a means for the membership to elect Pro tem Presidents if both VP and Pres is vacated. Now you have allowed the UBC to corrupt the intent of 32b just so you two clowns can say your were right.Hope your happy.I am holding up my hand with the finger between my index and ring finger extended. I salute you jackoffs.
      At least despite all your efforts to screw the members of 157 and leave them with no officers to run 157 you have Gausman to sign checks and facilitate the daily operation of 157 making it less of a takeover target for Mccarron.
 What happened at the 157 meeting was a ridiculous joke and laughable it it was not so tragic. All those involved including Nee,Biello and the rest should be brought up on charges.
   
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